Comments on: The myth of East-German newly manufactured P.38 pistols

By: Per Mathisen

Per Mathisen — Mon, 22 Mar 2021 18:06:30 +0000

Well guys you are way out of line with this barrel teori
Regards
Per

By: Per Mathisen

Per Mathisen — Sat, 06 Mar 2021 14:26:05 +0000

Hi there
Well…. not right !
That ring you see in the chamber is a chamber ridge.
You will find this in early HP pistols and through the 0-series P38 pistols.
This ridge was to give a better Seal to the soft brass sealing when the bullet was beeing fired.
When the steel cased ammunition came into general use in 1942, the chamber ridge was thought
to cause ejection failures. So armourers started to remove this ridge on early pistols, but you see them on early made pistols. Later P38 pistols did not have this ridge.
But again it is strange that the East Germans continuing making their barrels
this way ,

By: Per Mathisen

Per Mathisen — Sat, 06 Mar 2021 12:58:05 +0000

Hi there
Well…. not right !
That ring you see in the chamber is a chamber ridge.
You will find this in early HP pistols and through the 0-series P38 pistols.
This ridge was to give a better Seal to the soft brass casing when the bullet was beeing fired.
When the steel cased ammunition came into general use in 1942, the chamber ridge was thought
to cause ejection failures. So armourers started to remove this ridge on early pistols, but you see them on early made pistols. Later P38 pistols did not have this ridge.
But again it is strange that the East Germans continuing making their barrels
this way ,

By: Axel

Axel — Thu, 04 Feb 2021 17:59:14 +0000

Thanks for all the comments and input!
Chuck and I will be doing a video on the weekend addressing all these aspects.
Kind regards
Axel

By: Bob Adams

Bob Adams — Wed, 03 Feb 2021 23:35:17 +0000

Chuck: I just checked the matching barrel on N1000 (which is in new condition) and it also has the ring visible in the chamber, so it must be a new two piece assembly. However, the outside is properly machined so no seam or peening is visible.

I’d suggest that Suhl was left with an adequate supply of machinery to manufacture anything they needed.

It would be interesting to machine a cross-section in an old DDR P.38 barrel to see exactly how it was manufactured. The barrel shank could even be threaded to screw into the back half or could just be a press fit.

By: Bob Adams

Bob Adams — Wed, 03 Feb 2021 22:48:39 +0000

No doubt some engineers relocated to the Western Zone, but many did not. The Soviets forced a group of gun designers/engineers to relocate to Tula, but they returned to the DDR about 1950. I have a photograph and names of some when they returned to the DDR. Much documentation on German WWII firearms remain in the archives in Suhl, but Walther documents seem to have completely disappeared. Some of the machinery, but certainly not all, was acquired by the Soviet Union. The Soviets immediately restarted the manufacture of arms (and other goods) in the Soviet Zone using existing machinery, then allowed the companies to continue when the DDR was established. It’s a very interesting period but not well known in the West.

Regarding the two-piece P.38 barrels…. That could have been just an expedient shortcut in the manufacture of barrel assemblies. If it worked and was cheaper or faster to make, then why not? FN did the same in manufacturing HP barrels!

By: Storm

Storm — Wed, 03 Feb 2021 22:34:18 +0000

As for the concrete factory story, similar anecdote exists from Yugoslavia,
where first batch of Yugo cars, destined for a port to be shipped to USA, after the official shipping ceremony, train filled with them casually returned next day to factory, as they werent finished at all.

By: Storm

Storm — Wed, 03 Feb 2021 22:25:10 +0000

I suppose by mid 1950s many of these top ww2 engineers simply “defected” to west germany.

Books and blueprints could have been destroyed by germans in closing stages of ww2, or confiscated/looted by soviets, along with all the best machinery.

By: Storm

Storm — Wed, 03 Feb 2021 22:13:30 +0000

Why did they put the new barrel, what was wrong with the old one ?

By: Bob Adams

Bob Adams — Wed, 03 Feb 2021 15:23:59 +0000

Another thoughts…..
VEB Ernst Thälmann-Werke in Suhl certainly had the capability to produce any firearm and wouldn’t have to rely on reworked or spare parts. As a combination of the Suhl firearms companies (Gustloff, Sauer, Haenel, etc.), they had access to the best craftsmen and engineers in the area – except those sent to Tula in the Soviet Union. They also would have had blueprints and the manufacturing workbooks from Suhl and Zella-Mehlis – except for any removed to the West.

We know they manufactured the N-series Lugers and the production series of PP copies in .22 and .32.

This doesn’t mean they didn’t take advantage of reworked and spare parts, but they certainly didn’t rely only on those sources.